Ep209 Gina Riley - Beyond Qualifications: How Top Executives Land Hidden Leadership Opportunities

Gina Riley 0:00

Most of the opportunities and an aspiring leader, particularly executives at the senior levels, they need to have a healthy network, because much of those opportunities are going to be uncovered in what we call the hidden job market. Those who are top of mind in the hidden job market are the ones that will rise to the top to get seen and to get seen in any interview process is the name of the game.

Mike O'Neill 0:27

Welcome to get unstuck and on target, the weekly podcast that offers senior leaders insights and strategies to not only lead with confidence and vision, but also to achieve ground breaking results. I'm your host. Mike O'Neill, I coach top level executives on the power of ethical leadership to forge teams to be as united as they are effective in each episode, join me for insightful conversations with leaders just like you, providing practical advice to help you get unstuck and propel you and your company forward. Let's get started. What if landing your next executive role wasn't just about being qualified, but about standing out? So decision makers say we need you in this episode, I sit down with executive Career Strategist Gina Riley to uncover the truth about today's job market. With decades in corporate HR and executive search, Gina has helped top leaders secure the roles that they deserve. We explore why qualifications alone aren't enough, how to tap into the hidden job market and why your network and your personal brand may be your greatest assets. As an executive coach, I've seen firsthand how strategic positioning sets top leaders apart. It's about making an impact and staying on the radar of key decision makers. Tune in now and take control of your career. My guest today is Gina Riley, an executive career strategist who helps leaders navigate job searches and career transitions with a background in corporate HR at Intel and executive search at talents group, she has placed top executives in CEO COO and CFO roles. I'm particularly interested in bringing her back because she has a book coming up, entitled, qualified isn't enough, and explores how executives can uncover and leverage their own unique value proposition to stand out in today's highly competitive job market. Gina, welcome back.

Gina Riley 2:41

Thank you for having me, and I love how you said the book title.

Mike O'Neill 2:44

Oh, good. Oh, if you need an audio version, maybe I'll just have to make myself available for you. Maybe we are recording this for me in the afternoon, late morning for Gina, and we've been chatting, and I almost took all the time we had set aside just to get note, Gina, again, get kind of caught up. There are a number of things I'm looking forward to speaking with you, but Gina, let's just kind of tap into kind of your perspective, and that is that changing landscape, particularly when it comes to executive hiring. For those listening, who are either executives or aspiring executives, what kind of have you seen as the kind of those major shifts and how companies go about selecting their top leadership talent today?

Gina Riley 3:36

Yeah, let's first talk about, talk about the consistencies of what is true from, you know, the past to now, which is most of the opportunities. And an aspiring leader, particularly executives at the senior levels, what they really need to know is they need to have a healthy network, because much of those opportunities are going to be uncovered in what we call the hidden job market. And the hidden job market is not a place where jobs are hiding from you, it's where they're just percolating. We should almost call it the percolating job market. Maybe I should coin that Mike, and this is what it sounds like an executive team is sitting around at their group meeting, and somebody says, I'm going to go out on medical leave, I'm going on maternity leave. I'm retiring. We're gonna let Joe go. Something is happening to where a vacancy is coming up. And what is the first thing that leadership team says to each other and Mike, you probably know this as well. They can't. They look at each other and say, Who do we know? Yes, who do we know now? They are going to go dive into their network because that's who they know, like and trust, people who have built brands and a reputation, and they're going to go there first. It doesn't mean that they're not going to go to market for the job and open it up and look at diversity and diverse perspectives, etc. E but what it does mean is those who are top of mind in the hidden job market are the ones that will rise to the top to get seen and to get seen in any interview process, is the name of the game. You cannot get the job unless you at least get in front of decision makers. So the first way I would answer that is, 80% of your time is spent networking and building relationships and keeping your thought leadership active and alive. And what I think has shifted even further in that I'm going to apply to visible jobs online, is it's even harder to get seen because everyone who wants to apply for a job, whether they're qualified or not, can the access and the visibility to open jobs is so huge that the pipelines become massive, and in these senior level roles, only a fraction are actually qualified based on What that board or that executive team is looking for. And so what does that mean for those managing the pipeline, the recruiters and the executive search consultants, they are flooded, blooded with hundreds, maybe 1000s, of applications, most of which are not viable. And I can tell you, before the pandemic started, I conducted a COO search. So this is before all this nonsense that we're seeing today. I had 800 applicants that I personally looked at. I skimmed every single resume, and the very first resume, I'm going to cut to the chase, the first resume for a COO in healthcare that I was going to market for came from Mexico, and the person was in oil and gas, that I would have lost all credibility with the CEO and that board had I put someone like that forward. That means I don't know how to do my job. So back to your question, what's changed? You should be networking even harder to get into your next role.

Mike O'Neill 7:09

Let's talk about that networking. Those folks who are watching or listening might think, oh gosh, go into this big room, have a pocket full of business cards. That's not what we're talking about for executives in particular. What do you recommend and what does networking look like?

Gina Riley 7:32

Where I would start, the answer to this question is actually what I capture in chapter nine of my nine chapter book in qualified isn't enough, and that is thought leadership. Double down on what you want to put out into your ecosystem. What do you want to be most known for? And I have frameworks to do that. But in short, there's a lot of ways and a lot of platforms to do that. It could be being a guest on podcasts that are relevant to your audience in conjunction with the hosts. Audience could be writing short form posts on LinkedIn, could be collaborating on white papers, could be attending conferences and vying for speakership opportunities. Could be panelist type of things it could be, you know, volunteer board work, there's a lot of ways that you can become known for what you do best and when you do that. Guess what? Mike, now we're naturally networking. Now we're naturally building relationships that matter to our professional lives. And one great story that I have, I interviewed seven people for a series that I call how your next executive role finds you. It's a series of seven Angela Shaw is one of the people that I interviewed. She's a she's a high level HR CHRO individual, and one of the things she talks about her story is about volunteer leadership and how volunteering and being having roles in SHRM, which is one of the HR organizations in her state, elevated her status in such a way that people saw her as the go to, and that opened up opportunity after opportunity After opportunity.

Mike O'Neill 9:19

You know, I take notes when I'm listening, and I've taken notes. And it was really interesting, as you were kind of listing some things, I wrote down two things, and you immediately brought that up chapter nine, thought leadership. I want to kind of build on that I've understood thought leadership. You've mentioned several possible scenarios thought leadership could also be, how are you perceived from a social media standpoint, your knowledge out there, but you mentioned a number of things, and that is, how do you help a client gravitate towards those things are much more natural. What might be the kinds of questions you would ask? Clients that would help them identify where they can kind of lean into a thought leadership role that they hadn't done in the past.

Gina Riley 10:09

I love the question so much. So in this chapter, I have frameworks that help people tease out what those concepts are, what they want to be most known for. But what I start with Mike is who are your audiences? Because why charge down a path about leadership unless you have your archetype in mind of who you're trying to reach, right? And so in this table and in the moment, I'm not going to remember everything, but I'll list off a few things. If I'm a senior leader, some of my audience are going to be up sideways, down and out. So it could be appealing to the board members that are paying attention to what I'm doing. Could be the peers on my leadership team paying attention to what I'm doing. Definitely it's the employees that report up into us, and then now you're building up confidence, and as you move from job to job, those are the people that may want to come with you, right that you're bringing along with you. Then we start to look outside that ecosystem. It could be the people that you do business with, vendors, suppliers, customers, definitely customers. It could be even competitors. Because if you're out there and your competitors can see you, and they see you're doing great things, maybe you're a prime candidate to get recruited for a better opportunity, more lucrative, more beneficial to you and your family. So first start with who are you speaking to and with, and then start breaking down what you want to most be known for. And there's different things. One framework I use is I just make three columns, and I'll say, okay, in the past, what have people come to you for? What do people know you to do? What do people and then what do you what is your leadership approach? So there's a lot of different sub topics, aside from industry expertise that you may have that you really enjoy talking about? Maybe it's mentorship. I have a couple of people that I'm working with who are instrumental in developing the training programs and onboarding new consultants into the consulting firm that they work for. That's a pride point. They really love doing that. So there's a lot of content and thought leadership just in that. But the most important column of the three is, what do you want to be known for going forward? What do you want people to come to you for, and poach you from your company to you know or ask you to do a speaking gig? That's where you need to double down.

Mike O'Neill 12:35

You described an HR leader who was given back to the profession by serving in a leadership role that end up being in a state capacity, but in serving the visibility increased naturally. The who, in that case, these would be HR professionals, but the fact that whatever role this person was in. It adds credibility, because if they're on that board, they must know their stuff. And what I thought was really interesting, of all the things you got to focus on, what do you want to be known for? What do people come to you with? So you describe frameworks. I know this is in the your past book, your current book that's going to be coming out, but I love this idea of, kind of, how do you begin unpacking let's kind of get back to the practicality. Our listeners are leaders. Some of these are in key leadership roles, and they're contemplating, it can be a little bit overwhelming of all the themes that one has to kind of consider, if that makes sense, and I guess what else does? Yes, what I would throw out to you is when you mentioned when an opening occurs and the hidden job market. How? How do you do that? How does a leader be top of mind to the people that is, the WHO on the things, the what? What are the kinds of things that you find are most effective for leaders to most, at minimum, they should be doing these things.

Gina Riley 14:24

Okay, again, I'm going to kind of start where you don't want to be, which is, if you want to progress in your career and you have and you're ambitious and you're an achiever, do not wait to get plucked out of obscurity. Do not expect people to have you at the top of their mind when the role opens, it is on you at all times every year, to keep your relationships warm enough to where you are top of mind. So that is the first thing that that I would say, yeah. Now, one way to be top of mind is to lean into thought leadership. And if you'll let me, I've got a great story that I've represented in my book that ties together what you're asking me, How do I remain top of mind so that I can access the hidden job market? And I'll do that in conjunction with Thought Leadership. Perfect. Okay, so I in January, I had started working with a global sales VP of a major CPG product Products Company, big global company, and he'd been there for over 25 years, and he was ready for a change, because there had been a change in leadership, and he was just ready for something different, and definitely not done mid 50s, and ready for, ready for something else. And I would say, never been taught how to write a resume. Never been taught how to enter. He never had to massively successful at his company. So he starts to have some conversations and a competitive, a competing, global company. He knew some of those people from the current company, because it's all in the same, you know, general industry. So he starts having conversations, and he comes into my pipeline in January with conversations percolating four months of interviews Mike, and he finally learns he comes in number two now that which is just right. Yes, they really like them, but they have to promote an internal candidate. The SVP is told you need to, you need to promote so and so, because we're great of losing them. So that was a bummer. And they did offer him a secondary job for less pay in a in a market that he would have to move to that was more expensive, and so he politely declined. We continued our work together, because I generally contract nine months to a year, and so that's how long it takes for people to land. November rolls around and he gets a text from his intel on the inside, hey, the person that got that job is gone. So I rally with my client. He sends a very short text to the SVP and says, How can I help? I know you're in a tough spot. Within two weeks, we had a job offer for 25% higher pay, and he moved on into that next job, and that was a 12 month adventure for he and I, but what was happening from that four months window when he got the No, the first no and he got the offer? So we're talking almost six plus months. I'm not doing my math, thought leadership. He, over the course of a year, posted approximately 80 times he had not posted for six years. What was he posting on? And this was hard. It was hard at first, but the things that he wanted to be known for was his his experiences in leadership, running global teams, lean processes, diversity he, you know, huge on all of these things. And so he found his footing, and with the muscle memory and the practice, you know, and using AI to generate interesting images, developed a following. So he starts at the new global company, and they have a big global internal sales meeting with a bunch of sales people, and he's now a VP there, and people are coming up to him and they're shaking his hand and they're clapping him on the back, and they're like, I feel like I know you already. I have been following your content that my friend is how we move into a percolating role that did not get advertised on the second go because of consistent thought leadership and people feeling like you're the go to

Mike O'Neill 18:48

fantastic story on so many different levels. A person who hasn't posted in six years but end up doing 80 over a relatively short period of time, the more one writes open, the better writer they become. But as they write and they're happy with the outcome, the more they internalize that which they are. You mentioned muscle memory. What kind of popped in my head is it may be in your head, but it's in interactions. And you may have saw I just kind of sat up, and that is, what do you want to be known for? When you begin writing on it, you've got the luxury of thinking about it, and then you kind of ask, How do I convey what's in my mind? Who is my audience? And that that crafting, if you would, over time, means that he's polishing his capabilities the whole time. It's not just posting going out to a black hole. You said something that did catch my attention. And that is if the folks came up and said, I feel like I know you. What that says is the writing was not textbook. It was not technical. He allowed some of his personal. Personality to come through some of his experiences to come through. If I'm understanding that comment correctly, would that describe what you think happened?

Gina Riley 20:10

That's exactly what happened. It was absolutely transformative to have him go from, you know, relative obscurity and only being really known by a few people over his career to now showcasing that to all the people of his current the current company, and then the company he ended up going to think how big his ecosystem of ripple effect in his leadership approach, and think of how many, I'll just say, younger generations may be following him at this point, are getting content that they wouldn't otherwise see or get, because we're getting so much less human content. So we need our we need our boomers, and we need our Gen X ers to step into the light and share this content, because we have an awful lot of managers who are managing people who aren't even present physically for our people.

Mike O'Neill 21:04

Earlier in the conversation, you made reference to about just genuineness in terms of relationship ability, and that comes to kind of loud and clear, I love that as kind of an example. Can you share? Maybe a maybe it's something this might be a perfect illustration of what I typically ask a guest, and that is, this was a leader. Let's just use him, for example, where it was a long, protracted process, and when you're used to being kind of high in the food chain in our organization, and then you're not how do you help with the just the feeling of, Am I wanted anymore? Because a protracted job search can be very discouraging. How do you help your clients when they kind of get that feeling of being stuck, kind of get unstuck and stick with the plan.

Gina Riley 22:05

It happens a lot, especially at the levels that you and I are talking about, because by the time many people decide that they are itchy and need to make a transition, whatever that reason, layoffs are coming, I don't like the new boss that just got put over me. It doesn't matter what it is, a lot of times they're already super behind the eight ball because they haven't been percolating, haven't been warming up relationships in the first place. So now we're starting from a personal feeling of deficit. And so I would say part of getting unstuck is reframing what you need to do and what you have ahead of you, and applying the strategic nature of your business acumen and what you've done for businesses and apply being strategic to yourself. You need to have a plan and a strategy for a job search, and you need to be strategic about and have a cadence for reaching out to people, having zoom copies, having real copies, taking people to dinner, having conversations, going to some conferences and meeting people. So you, if you're starting from that, that place of initial feeling of deficit, having a deficit, you must get yourself out of that so you can put your best foot forward. Other people cannot accept the baggage you're going to bring. If you're bringing that downtrodden behind the eight ball feeling that's not what people are hiring. So you know. And if you're in a place where you're feeling particularly stuck, sad, worried, anxiety. Sometimes it's not just a coach, like a leadership coach, Career Coach. Sometimes you need even more. You need a therapist. In conjunction with that, and I've actually had a couple people are like, Oh yeah, I got a therapist and I got you, let's go. And it's a really beautiful marriage of support for one human being. I think everyone should consider it's like going to the dentist. Having a therapist is a great thing, right? You know, getting those checkups. So to get unstuck, you need to get centered on your unique value proposition, and you need to be confident that you do have one. And that's what people get, Mike is, most of the time they're thinking, I need to go create a resume, because I'm going to start job hunting. Well, I would say, Hey leader, hey executive. What are you going to do with that? Are you going to start spraying and praying into applicant tracking systems, hoping and praying that someone's going to call you? You're the teeny percentage that gets a call, or are you going to get centered on your UVP unique value proposition and start having conversations so you can test your UVP and see where it's going to be the most applicable. And that is a different strategy that is not job hunting, that is having conversations to open up opportunities. Entities where you're the most needed. It's a totally different mindset.

Mike O'Neill 25:04

Yeah. Another thing that just resonates with me, Gina, is, as one goes up the organizational chart, the role becomes much more, longer focused, more strategic, if you would. We're talking about C suite type positions today, and that is they're supposed to be looking not the current quarter, not the current year, but further and anticipate those things. What you're advising us, the listeners, is, take the same mindset when it comes to your own career growth. Think strategic, think long game, be thinking about the unique value proposition oftentimes heard in marketing terms. But what is it that you bring to an organization, to teams that is unique, that plays to your strengths? I love the name of your book. Qualified isn't enough, because it you already beared out the numbers through that time and time again. If you could offer one piece of advice as we're wrapping up, that would give executives kind of looking to accelerate their careers and secure top leadership roles. What would that be?

Gina Riley 26:26

Just one? Goodness. I'm going to do a one two punch, if you'll allow me one one. I believe all of us have a unique value proposition, regardless if there's a ton of people that do the kinds of things we do, because it comes from our unique talents, our values, the things that motivate us, our personality, and the collection of our career experiences. Nobody has exactly that. Get centered on that, and then get centered around the things you want to be most known for. And once you start bringing those two into harmonious alignment or congruency, and start to share that with the world, and it doesn't have to be a TEDx, but just be something like going to conferences or being on a panel or a few little short form posts, that's how that's a starting point for accelerating career success. There's a lot of more moving parts. That's why there's a nine chapter book. But I like the end cap, chapter one, chapter nine. Bring it together.

Mike O'Neill 27:34

You know, for folks who want to dive deeper, I'm going to invite you connect with Gina in doing so you can explore her career velocity framework and insights into this upcoming book. Qualified isn't enough. You know Gina. You know this. I hope our listeners know what I'm not hosting a podcast. I have a business called bench builders, and we focus on executive coaching and Leadership Development Development, and we're really trying to help them. The participants really thrive in their roles. So if you're listening and you want to strengthen your leadership skills or you want to tackle workplace challenges, visit bench builders.com and let's see how we might be able to help but Gina, before we go, for those who do want to connect with you and learn more about your work, what's the best way for them to do that?

Gina Riley 28:27

The best way I have two Gina Riley consulting.com there is a free downloadable webinar where you can get a free career transition planning guide. That is not a sales pitch, it's absolutely free, and that helps get you a framework. And then the second thing is, as you know, Mike, I hang out on LinkedIn. I'm there every day. I post videos. I write for Forbes coaches Council. I'm promoting those articles. I've written more than 5050, articles, not just for Forbes coaches Council, but in total. So there's a lot of content there that are more than job seeking tips. They're real stories and real ways of helping people move the needle. So connect with me on LinkedIn. That's another thing to do. And say that you heard me on bench builders, and I'll know the connection, which is great. Yes,

Mike O'Neill 29:14

it is. Now for those who are watching this, we're gonna include that content information. Yeah, get unstuck, and we'll go put all that content information in the show notes. So be looking for that. So I do also want to thank our subscribers. Thank you for joining us, and I hope this conversation today with Gina has sparked some new ideas to help you get unstuck and on target. Thank you for joining us for this episode of get unstuck and on target. I hope you've gained insights to help you lead with confidence and drive your organization forward. Remember at bench builders, we're committed to your success, your leadership excellence and your strategic growth. If you've enjoyed our conversation today, please leave a review rate and. Subscribe to keep up with our latest episodes. This show really grows when listeners like you share it with others. Who do you know, who needs to hear what we talked about today? Until next time, I encourage you to stay focused on the target and continue to break new ground on your leadership path. You

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