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Dec. 5, 2024

Ep198 John Ghiorso - From Exit to Empire: Building 5 Marketing Agencies at Once

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Get Unstuck & On Target

From Serial Entrepreneur to Venture Studio Pioneer: How John Ghiorso is Reshaping the Agency Landscape

Are you ready to witness the birth of something extraordinary in the agency world? Meet John Ghiorso, a successful entrepreneur who sold his Amazon-focused agency Orca Pacific to Media Monks, only to discover that retirement wasn't his true calling. Now, he's embarking on an ambitious mission to launch five marketing agencies in just two years through his new venture studio.

In this enlightening conversation with Mike O'Neill, John shares his unique approach to building multiple agencies simultaneously, drawing from his extensive experience in the digital marketing space. With one agency already operational and another close to launch, John openly discusses his strategy for creating scalable, successful service businesses in the B2B sector.

Key Insights to Look Out For:

• Why most agencies struggle with growth and profitability, and how systematic operational frameworks can change that

• The power of building in public and sharing knowledge, even in a competitive landscape

• How consuming high-quality information and making better decisions leads to accelerated business success

John's practical wisdom extends beyond theory - he's putting his experience to work in real-time, creating a venture studio that aims to transform how agencies are built and scaled. His approach combines proven operational frameworks with innovative growth strategies, all while maintaining complete bootstrap control.

Ready to transform your perspective on building and scaling service businesses? Check out this episode to learn from someone who's not just talking about it but actively doing it. Subscribe to get more insights from successful entrepreneurs who are reshaping their industries.

Transcript

00:00:00:00 - 00:00:02:19
John Ghiorso
when I retired or attempted to retire,

 

00:00:02:19 - 00:00:05:22
John Ghiorso
I realized, you know, I, I actually did really kind of miss

 

00:00:05:22 - 00:00:06:23
John Ghiorso
running agencies.

 

00:00:06:23 - 00:00:09:04
John Ghiorso
I didn't want to just do the same thing I'd already done

 

00:00:09:04 - 00:00:13:12
John Ghiorso
instead of, like, starting one and, you know, running it over ten years like I did before.

 

00:00:13:12 - 00:00:18:16
John Ghiorso
goal is to start five and rapidly grow them over, you know, three or 4 or 5 years.

 

00:00:21:05 - 00:00:31:01
Mike O'Neill
welcome to Get Unstuck and On Target, the weekly podcast that offers senior leaders insights and strategies to not only lead with competence and vision,

 

00:00:31:05 - 00:00:34:01
Mike O'Neill
but also to achieve groundbreaking results.

 

00:00:34:12 - 00:00:44:12
Mike O'Neill
I'm your host, Mick O'Neill. I coach top level executives on the power of ethical leadership to forge teams to be as united as they are effective

 

00:00:45:11 - 00:00:46:13
Mike O'Neill
in each episode.

 

00:00:46:18 - 00:00:56:20
Mike O'Neill
Join me for insightful conversations with leaders just like you, providing practical advice to help you get unstuck and propel you and your company forward.

 

00:00:57:18 - 00:00:58:19
Mike O'Neill
Let's get started.

 

00:01:03:13 - 00:01:33:21
Mike O'Neill
Have you ever wondered what it takes to successively build, sell and start over? This time with even bigger ambitions? In this episode, I sit down with John Durso, an entrepreneur who founded one of the world's leading Amazon agencies, Soledad, and is now launching not one but five new marketing agencies in rapid succession. John Story isn't just about business growth, it's about vision, resilience and the power of leveraging lessons learned.

 

00:01:33:23 - 00:01:58:18
Mike O'Neill
We explore how he's applying his operational frameworks to scale faster, and why he's building this next chapter in public. His approach resonates deeply with the leaders I coach, who often face the challenge of taking bold, decisive steps to reach the next level. If you are ready to rethink how you approach growth and leadership, this conversation will lead you inspired and armed with fresh insights.

 

00:01:58:20 - 00:02:04:09
Mike O'Neill
I'm Mike O'Neill and this is the Get Unstuck and On Target podcast. Let's dive in.

 

00:02:04:09 - 00:02:11:09
Mike O'Neill
Joining me is John Durso. In 2008, John founded Orca Pacific, a full service Amazon agent,

 

00:02:11:22 - 00:02:31:02
Mike O'Neill
over the following decade. He built it into one of the world's leading Amazon and e-commerce agencies. In 2020, he made the decision to sell orca to media marks. He stayed on for three years to complete Earnout, and he further expanded the business into the enterprise market 2023.

 

00:02:31:02 - 00:02:54:05
Mike O'Neill
He decided to retire, but quickly realized retirement wasn't for him. John is now in the process of building a new company, a venture studio that aims to launch five marketing agencies over the next two years. While the studio at this recording has yet to be named, it already has one agency up and running, with a second one close behind.

 

00:02:54:07 - 00:03:06:12
Mike O'Neill
Unlike the last time John will be building in public, openly sharing lessons he's learned from growing his first company and how he's applying those insights to his next venture. Welcome, John.

 

00:03:06:14 - 00:03:08:20
John Ghiorso
Thanks, Mike. Thanks for having me on.

 

00:03:08:22 - 00:03:33:07
Mike O'Neill
John, we were talking before we hit the record button about, which platforms do we typically use? You mentioned LinkedIn. That is my preferred platform as well. What you didn't mention is you have nearly 22,000 followers on LinkedIn. And what caught my attention, and that's how you and I first connected. We share 25 mutual connections. I had to have you on a podcast.

 

00:03:33:07 - 00:03:34:20
Mike O'Neill
Did I not?

 

00:03:34:22 - 00:03:44:05
John Ghiorso
I like it. I like it. It took me a while to get up to that, that number, but, but yeah, it's it's served me well in my career.

 

00:03:44:07 - 00:04:11:15
Mike O'Neill
You have chosen the entrepreneurial route. And the things that you have done really intrigued me. I love bringing entrepreneurs onto the podcast, but I particularly like to bring those folks who have started and have run business from a successful standpoint. You have done so sold and you start all over again and I'm a little bit intrigued. For those who are not familiar with kind of the niche that you're working these agencies.

 

00:04:11:15 - 00:04:16:06
Mike O'Neill
Can you kind of explain what is it you're intended to do over the next couple of years or so?

 

00:04:16:08 - 00:04:40:10
John Ghiorso
Yeah. So, I mean, you know, my kind of my entire, professional career has been in agency entrepreneurship, right? Starting and running, marketing service companies. The first one I did was, Amazon focused. We were kind of like one of the there were contemporaries, but one of the original Amazon full service agencies, you know, grew that up to around 100 people.

 

00:04:40:10 - 00:05:03:00
John Ghiorso
It was a it was a solid business and sold it. And, you know, kind of long story short, but when I retired or attempted to retire, I realized, you know, I, I actually did really kind of miss running a business. And specifically, I missed, running agencies. It's an interesting type of business. It's not for everybody. They're like all businesses.

 

00:05:03:00 - 00:05:22:21
John Ghiorso
There are, you know, great things about it, and they're really challenging, difficult things about it. But, you know, it's what I know. It's what I love. It's what I've done for 15 years, and. And I, while candidly, I was a little burned out on e-commerce as a domain, I was not burned out on the agency concept as a as a business model.

 

00:05:22:23 - 00:05:44:17
John Ghiorso
And I in some ways feel like I'm just kind of getting started and there's so much more even, you know, for me to learn still. So, so I was excited about it. I, I didn't want to just do the same thing I'd already done over again. So I decided to take a different spin on it this time, which is to basically force multiply my experience and expertise.

 

00:05:44:17 - 00:06:11:04
John Ghiorso
And, you know, frankly, capital at this point, to attempt to start multiple agencies in pretty rapid succession. So and just instead of, like, starting one and, you know, running it over ten years like I did before. The goal is to start five and rapidly grow them over, you know, three or 4 or 5 years. So, kind of push the boundaries a little bit of what's possible inside of this business model.

 

00:06:11:06 - 00:06:32:24
Mike O'Neill
So when you do that force multiplier, this is something that you you've learned a lot by doing it yourself, but you did it on a much slower timeframe. What are the things that for those who don't know what we're talking about, can you just explain? An agency as we're talking about digital agency. What are the kind of services a digital agency provides?

 

00:06:33:01 - 00:06:52:10
John Ghiorso
Yeah. So, I mean, there's the last I checked. It depends on what study you look at, but there's somewhere between 40 and 100,000 agencies in the US alone. Like marks. Yeah, it's it's wild. Now, a lot of those are probably one person, right, that say they're an agency, but still, but, you know, traditionally, you know, it's outsourced marketing services.

 

00:06:52:10 - 00:07:16:01
John Ghiorso
So it's, it's a business that, you know, functionally specializes in a specific domain. You know, some some big ones are paid media, SEO, you know, creative. Like, those are some of the big, big categories out there. But, you know, you can get into really, really niche services, right? Like there's, you know, services that book people on podcast, the services that just make banner ads for one specific type of advertising.

 

00:07:16:01 - 00:07:41:21
John Ghiorso
And that's all they do. And they're kind of the best in the world at it. But, but, you know, basically the business model is, is outsource. Specialized marketing services. And the new domain broadly that I've chosen to kind of launch all of these, various agencies and, is into the world of B2B. So B2B is obviously a pretty big category in and of itself.

 

00:07:41:21 - 00:08:01:17
John Ghiorso
But, but all of the agencies I'm launching will be focused on kind of niche, productized services. So, you know, repeatable value, additive, ongoing services that sit inside of this, you know, overall kind of, B2B, ICP.

 

00:08:01:19 - 00:08:15:11
Mike O'Neill
As a person who's investing this way, you have a choice. You're choosing to do it this way. What is it about this rapid expansion that appeals to you personally?

 

00:08:15:13 - 00:08:37:23
John Ghiorso
So agencies are, are usually not very good businesses. And what I mean by that is, is, is that they're like, they're they don't grow very fast. They're low margin. They're kind of like high stress. They're not very profitable like as a category to kind of like restaurants. Like on average, a restaurant is not a business to be in.

 

00:08:37:24 - 00:09:01:02
John Ghiorso
That being said, there are restaurant, you know, serial entrepreneurs that have been incredibly successful in this kind of systemized how to do this, right. So I'm I'm just very interested one in that concept, in terms of kind of pushing the bounds of what's possible. Two I've been a bootstrap guy. Like, I've never raised money. I'm probably not going to raise money for this venture.

 

00:09:01:04 - 00:09:26:00
John Ghiorso
And I kind of like that. Because I like being in control. I like just being able to make all the decisions, being ultimately in control. I, you know, while I haven't necessarily experienced the opposite of that or the alternative, I should say it's not really something that appeals to me. So, agencies you can bootstrap because unlike some other companies, there's not a big capital requirement, right?

 

00:09:26:00 - 00:09:47:13
John Ghiorso
There's services. You can get them to profitability quite quickly. You know, you don't have to go pay millions of dollars for, you know, equipment or to develop code or, you know, you can just kind of start doing the service or you can just launch it very quickly. Most agencies are also, they're not very well systematized.

 

00:09:47:13 - 00:10:16:20
John Ghiorso
And for me, that's the big unlock. Like the big unlock here is not just like throwing stuff against a wall and seeing what sticks, but taking a very deliberate operational framework, in, in kind of multiple aspects of the business. So basically taking a road tested operating framework and then changing out the team, because obviously every team is unique and changing up the domain because obviously they're kind of new bets on new new domains, but then having consistency across the operational framework.

 

00:10:16:22 - 00:10:34:22
John Ghiorso
And you know, frankly, I think it's going to be super profitable. Like that's also obviously part of the goal here is like make this make sense economically. And I think there can be a lot of value created in a pretty short amount of time, where I'm not given a big chunks of the company to investors.

 

00:10:34:22 - 00:10:43:04
Mike O'Neill
this operational framework you describe, would that mean each of these entities as it comes online would be pretty much independent from the others.

 

00:10:43:06 - 00:11:02:24
John Ghiorso
It will be. But they'll share the same DNA. So, you know, functionally I don't even know what my title is yet, but I'm going to be kind of functionally like a chairman. But also more than a chairman because I'll be in, in, in kind of the, in the day to day to, to some degree with all the businesses.

 

00:11:03:00 - 00:11:22:20
John Ghiorso
Yeah. They're going to share like a lot of the so agency entrepreneurs all kind of have to invent this stuff, which is interesting. Like, I know lots of other agency entrepreneurs. Yep. Some a lot more successful than me. We all invented all this, like, operating framework over years and years. We all kind of ended up in the same place.

 

00:11:22:23 - 00:11:48:17
John Ghiorso
I find that very interesting. Like, we all invented the wheel, but we all thought we were the first person to invent the wheel. And we looked around, we're like, oh, there's a lot of other wheels. And, most agency entrepreneurs, though, don't start multiple agencies. Most of them just do it. One time I did it for a bunch of reasons, so that knowledge gets sort of like lost, you know, and just every other new agency entrepreneur has to kind of like reinvent the same stuff.

 

00:11:48:19 - 00:12:12:13
John Ghiorso
And it just creates, a lot of inefficiency and kind of slowness and, yeah, basically, I think I can like, you know, stand on my own kind of, experience and, and just get to a place where these things are, you know, efficiently running. They're growing quickly, much faster than they're not, frankly, the competitors.

 

00:12:12:13 - 00:12:38:05
Mike O'Neill
So I don't know if you can or would want to answer this question, but what I'm envisioning is you've kind of put yourself on a, a Ryzen launch these with the next two years, have or run out 3 to 5 years. But if you have this operational framework and it's fine tune as you go, it would seem to me that it could just be what you do on an indefinite basis.

 

00:12:38:05 - 00:12:50:03
Mike O'Neill
You just keep growing in that particular niche. But if what you're describing works there, it would work in almost any industry, would it not?

 

00:12:50:05 - 00:13:08:16
John Ghiorso
I think it would work in any service business. Well, I shouldn't say any service business. I don't I don't know if I could start like an accounting firm and do this right, but I think it would work in any agency. And again, 100,000 of these things. Pretty broad world. Yes. So I'll answer your your question this way.

 

00:13:08:18 - 00:13:34:12
John Ghiorso
If this works, and I've kind of call my shot right. It kind of puts some pressure on me. I like that it like, go. I have to go do this now. So if this works, if all or the majority of these agencies are successful, and I have a co-founder, by the way, to doing this with me, but but what we will have effectively created is a business that launches businesses.

 

00:13:34:14 - 00:13:55:13
John Ghiorso
And while each one of these agencies is important and we want them to be successful and we're going to do everything we can to make sure they're offering, you know, great value to the clients, etc.. There is this other business that sits on top of it, which is the venture studio, and that is the thing that becomes really interesting because we can do with five.

 

00:13:55:15 - 00:14:25:13
John Ghiorso
We can do it with ten or 20 or 30 or, you know, I mean, the venture studio itself becomes the most compelling part of the entire business, potentially, there's also this interesting sort of net, concept where we're launching companies that do services to grow B2B companies. Right? Like our clients will be B2B companies. And our goal ultimately, in one way or another, is to help them grow.

 

00:14:25:15 - 00:14:51:10
John Ghiorso
We're also B2B companies, right? So there's this sort of self-referential thing where we can dogfood our own services and not only launch, but very quickly scale these agencies using the other agencies capabilities. So while they will all be standalone businesses, they can certainly can and will help one another out. And then that also becomes this really kind of compelling flywheel if we, if we do it right.

 

00:14:51:15 - 00:15:15:22
Mike O'Neill
So as I'm listening to you and for those who are watching, you can see your eyes kind of light up in terms of what possibilities, might, might unfold. You've chosen the route you have. You've mentioned there's such upside potential if this work and you've also described from a business model standpoint, why this has so much going for it.

 

00:15:15:24 - 00:15:28:11
Mike O'Neill
We have as listeners, entrepreneurs, we have leaders out there. What is it about doing this that just excites you to get you up in the morning?

 

00:15:28:13 - 00:15:55:06
John Ghiorso
You know, I spent a lot of time thinking about this, and I had convinced myself that I was my first company was done for mainly extrinsic reasons. My at once I had achieve those goals, I was done. That's why I retired. I was like, okay, mission accomplished, sold a company. I'm good. I'm going to hang out and, you know, read books and, and kind of live my life like, there's no wrong with that stuff.

 

00:15:55:06 - 00:16:06:04
John Ghiorso
But, what I realized kind of when that was take it away, is that there is intrinsic value here as well.

 

00:16:08:01 - 00:16:31:16
John Ghiorso
You know, this is a me thing, right? I don't know if this is advice, but for me, I do need to be building and accomplishing things. I don't know why I don't. It's just the way I'm wired. I'm not entirely sure, but I am much more fulfilled. When I'm working on hard problems with people I like.

 

00:16:31:16 - 00:16:58:23
John Ghiorso
And we're kind of jointly accomplishing and creating, value. You know, I, I love creating something that goes beyond me that like, yes, I might have started it hired people and they're my ideas and but like, the thing then becomes just its own sort of like organism. I don't know why, but that's, like, incredibly rewarding to me.

 

00:16:59:01 - 00:17:18:20
John Ghiorso
Probably something that's been wired into my DNA through, you know, 100,000 years of evolution, I suppose. But, but it's just that I get super excited about it, and I like being excited about stuff. Like, I like waking up in the morning and, you know, looking forward to my day. So, yeah.

 

00:17:18:22 - 00:17:45:11
Mike O'Neill
You know, I don't know if I even said this out loud because as you're talking, what part in my head is I come out of a corporate HR background, a led HR for fast growing companies. I understood corporate life, but for the past 15 years I've been an entrepreneur and I have found myself drawn to entrepreneurs like yourself because what I'm finding is successful entrepreneurs aren't that hard wired differently.

 

00:17:45:13 - 00:18:09:17
Mike O'Neill
If I had to say what probably is exciting me is how does one infuse entrepreneurial mindset back into corporate, who tend to get set in their ways? I love you use the term I called my shot. That's a sports, you know, referencing. You made a decision, but you also made an interesting decision. You can go you can do all this publicly.

 

00:18:09:19 - 00:18:16:01
Mike O'Neill
And you can be open about that. Is there a risk of it being done in a way that the world is watching?

 

00:18:16:03 - 00:18:42:21
John Ghiorso
Yes. There are two big risks. And this was not, a some people take building public to an extreme and it's not necessarily a judgment, but that's not what I'm attempting to do. I'm not going to release my financials. Right. As an example like some companies do. They just share their whole pal. There's two risks. One is I fail and that is, like, it's just a big hit to my ego, right?

 

00:18:42:21 - 00:19:03:00
John Ghiorso
Yeah. That's basically risk one. Risk two is I overshare and it creates competitive pressure like competitors know what we're doing, and they knock us off. And, you know, the agency world is one of, a very few barriers to entry, right? Anyone can start agency. You don't need a degree. You don't need to. You know, you don't need to pass the bar.

 

00:19:03:01 - 00:19:23:24
John Ghiorso
You just can do it. So those are the two. I mean, the first one is just it is what it is. The second one is, is is frankly like I do. I am thoughtful about that. Like, if someone reads this, could they just, like, completely copy us, like, probably not. Right? Like they're not gonna read a LinkedIn post and then like, be able to reverse engineer or strategy?

 

00:19:24:18 - 00:19:49:04
John Ghiorso
But here's that's the risk. Here's the upside of it. I am a big believer in general in business, in just giving away as much as you can for free. And then like, not like just sitting back and waiting necessarily, but just generally expecting that the more you do that, the more is going to come back to you.

 

00:19:49:06 - 00:20:11:22
John Ghiorso
That is not as altruistic as it sounds. That is selfish, practical approach if you do it the right way. But I think it's it's balance. If you're both but you can't fake it right, you have to genuinely be interested in teaching people and helping them succeed and and sharing value with them. But then you also do have a, a profit motive.

 

00:20:11:24 - 00:20:29:17
John Ghiorso
And, and I've kind of used that in multiple aspects of use that in sale. That's how I approach sales, how I approach marketing. It's how I approach, you know, like lots of things I do kind of in the overall realm of, of business. But I've, I just found that to be super effective. So this building public kind of component of that is new.

 

00:20:29:17 - 00:20:36:23
John Ghiorso
But the underlying philosophy I think is something I've, I've carried for a while.

 

00:20:37:00 - 00:20:52:16
Mike O'Neill
I think before we hit the record button, we were talking about platforms. And you've chosen, LinkedIn as a platform and you've grown your followers to the size they have. What is it about LinkedIn that has served your purpose and will likely serve your purpose going forward?

 

00:20:52:18 - 00:21:21:10
John Ghiorso
I have been a fan of LinkedIn for probably at least seven years. I've been active on there. So there's this is all very related. So the first company, which I did not start in our studio. So it's not really a venture studio. It's more like a portfolio company. But the first business that's part of this, broad endeavor was started by my former director of marketing, who worked at my old agency, and he's now my co-founder in this new venture studio.

 

00:21:21:10 - 00:21:41:04
John Ghiorso
Anyway, that business is, a full service LinkedIn agency. Net a seed of the idea for that business is, Garrett, my former director of marketing and our business partner at orca seven years ago was like, you need to be on LinkedIn and you need to be talking on LinkedIn. And he was way ahead of the curve on this, and I was reluctant.

 

00:21:41:06 - 00:21:59:17
John Ghiorso
I was like, no, that's weird. It's cheesy. Like, that's not me. I don't want to. And he's like, just try it. Basically. Long story short, I did a few posts. It worked. I got a like, we got like a one lead out of it, you know, and just I did a complete 180. It was like, I'm just here to make the business successful.

 

00:21:59:17 - 00:22:27:10
John Ghiorso
Whatever I can do, I'll do. And it was like, okay, this works, let's do more of it. And it worked more and more and more and more. So one, I love it from a just practical business results standpoint. Like if you have something to say, you have a unique idea about your industry. You know, you're in some role where you're trying to create more opportunity for you as an entrepreneur or for your company, or, you know, you're in sales.

 

00:22:27:10 - 00:22:45:21
John Ghiorso
But even if, like, it's almost always a good idea to be creating content on LinkedIn, but two, you know, they're doing great. Like, I think they're super well run. They've become we were talking about this before we hit record. They become probably the only like, I want to use the word safe space because that's a loaded term.

 

00:22:45:21 - 00:23:05:22
John Ghiorso
But like, they've become the only social media platform that's just like professional and sort of like general pleasant. And there's no like downside of of being on there, you know, I mean, sure, I guess could you waste some time potentially. But like for me, I spend time on LinkedIn and I feel like I get smarter every time I'm on there.

 

00:23:05:22 - 00:23:22:00
John Ghiorso
Just listening to experts talk about different things, connect with tons of people. And, yeah, I think they've done a fantastic job. And I still think there's a lot of kind of upside potential for that company. And, I'm just a big, big fan of of what they're doing.

 

00:23:22:02 - 00:23:35:00
Mike O'Neill
I appreciate your insights, John, as you kind of think about your entrepreneurial journey so far and you share an example where perhaps you or a client got stuck and when that happened, what did it take to get unstuck?

 

00:23:35:02 - 00:24:04:04
John Ghiorso
So I got stuck with my agency about halfway through my sort of journey. So I think this was like 2015. We had started to our growth had started to slow down a bit. And, you know, this could be a 30 minute kind of explanation, but the headline here is that, all agencies have some degree of churn, and your churn is relative to revenue.

 

00:24:04:06 - 00:24:18:14
John Ghiorso
Right? So the more revenue you have, the more like net churn you have. But growth is typically it's not relative to revenue. So if you're adding $1 million a year in your business, that's great. But at some point it'll equalize.

 

00:24:18:16 - 00:24:19:09
Mike O'Neill
Yeah.

 

00:24:19:11 - 00:24:38:18
John Ghiorso
And that was starting to happen. And it wasn't because growth wasn't going well. It's just we hadn't scaled growth in proportion to the size of the business. So I would say that was stuck like that was like maybe pretty literally a sort of stock. Or I was getting close to being stuck. Like I could see the math and where the trend line is going in.

 

00:24:38:18 - 00:25:04:05
John Ghiorso
It was like, oh, this, this just stops. Like the growth stops. So that's when I decided to go from a one person me growth team to building out, I think, like a ten person team over about a year, fully kind of built a full stack growth team, systematized it, started to really understand all the attribution and the math that went into it, make sure it was capital efficient.

 

00:25:04:07 - 00:25:25:19
John Ghiorso
You know, we were bootstrapped company, so we had to like the investment, had to pay for itself pretty quickly. And, you know, honestly, like, that's I would say when I became really educated in a lot of the stuff that I'm doing now, before then, I was like an e-commerce guy, and I was an e-commerce expert, but I wasn't necessarily like a pro, a business expert.

 

00:25:25:21 - 00:25:42:03
John Ghiorso
And, you know, that was like a forcing function to go, we have to figure this out. And I hired some really great people around me, and and we did. And the company actually started growing faster than it ever had. And, you know, a couple of years later, we were able to, to sell it.

 

00:25:42:05 - 00:25:56:02
Mike O'Neill
Guys, you reflect on your journey so far, if you had to kind of pick one piece of advice that you would share, be it for leaders who are trying to grow their business or maybe even like you considering starting over, what would that be?

 

00:25:56:04 - 00:26:24:24
John Ghiorso
I think people need to spend a lot more of their time consuming, high quality information. So I would say reading, but you don't have to literally read books. I mean, they can be podcasts, can be articles, blogs, whatever. I think honestly, 20% of your sort of economically productive time, you know, not golfing or spending time with your kids or whatever, should be spent on consuming information, not just doing work.

 

00:26:25:01 - 00:26:53:12
John Ghiorso
And I would say that for W-2 employees trying to, you know, do better in their career. For entrepreneurs, it is the single like probably the single most important capability that we have as a species is to learn from others who have not already done a thing, synthesize that information, and then make better decisions going forward because of that information.

 

00:26:53:14 - 00:27:11:04
John Ghiorso
And I just think most people get the ratio wrong. I have people read books, I get it. But like, I think if if people consume massive quantities of information over a couple of years, they will be shocked at how much they will accelerate, in their career.

 

00:27:11:06 - 00:27:32:18
Mike O'Neill
Can I make sure I understand correctly? One of the things I hear you say is that you want to learn from a variety of sources. Yep. But learning in itself is not what you're saying. But in learning is how you do. You apply that learning in a way that might open up thoughts, be it whatever it you might not have thought before.

 

00:27:32:20 - 00:27:48:16
Mike O'Neill
How do you take this yearning to learn and make sure that that you're benefiting from that? What is it you are asking yourself? Why you're doing this? To make sure that it doesn't just get tucked away somewhere and forgotten.

 

00:27:48:18 - 00:28:05:09
John Ghiorso
So I try to focus on topics that are sometimes very directly related to what I'm doing, but not always. Sometimes sort of second order, like tangentially related.

 

00:28:05:11 - 00:28:28:02
John Ghiorso
So, you know, maybe obvious example, but like, you know, I've, I've read this actually a couple of years ago before the AI craze, I maybe read like five books on AI, right? Not a tactical guy. I'm not reading, like, technical books on machine learning, but like, but, like, just, you know, kind of popular nonfiction, books on kind of where is this going?

 

00:28:28:02 - 00:28:50:21
John Ghiorso
What's the bull case? What's the bear case like? You know, there's a book by, Henry Kissinger that was a, you know, there's like various kind of experts with, you know, views on politics, culture and society and the actual, like the tech industry and like on, the military industry and kind of like how this is going to impact things.

 

00:28:50:23 - 00:29:13:18
John Ghiorso
I now now the AI is like becoming sort of a very important today thing for me. Anyone running an agency, I have this depth of knowledge that most people wouldn't naturally have. I certainly naturally have learned this in school, and I think I make better decisions around the practical application of AI in my day to day business.

 

00:29:13:22 - 00:29:45:01
John Ghiorso
Because three years ago I read these five books I didn't necessarily like. Plan on launching an agency that would have AI capabilities. But I think just being broadly educated, in things that could sort of come up your brain is this incredible machine that will start making all these connections. You don't necessarily have to kind of preplan for those connections to be made right, by just consuming more information.

 

00:29:45:01 - 00:30:13:19
John Ghiorso
It's your brain's like a supercomputer, but it's only as good as the inputs. More inputs. You put into it, the better outputs i.e. decisions you will make. And honestly, other than the actual effort like showing up and doing the work, most of success is dependent on decision making. It's just makes better decisions. Are those are the people that when everyone kind of works the same amount, like, you know, Jeff Bezos probably doesn't work a whole lot more hours than I work.

 

00:30:13:21 - 00:30:29:24
John Ghiorso
Yet he's, you know, a thousands of times more successful. Me why? Because he's made better decisions. Just I think that's that's the X factor. So if you can allow yourself to make better decisions, you will, level up much faster.

 

00:30:30:01 - 00:30:52:15
Mike O'Neill
A good answer at. John, before we wrap up, I've got a question for the leaders in the audience. And that is why do people choose to follow your lead? Is it out of obligation, or do they truly believe in your vision as an executive coach, I hope leaders develop clarity and confidence and resilience to navigate those challenges and inspire their teams.

 

00:30:52:17 - 00:31:19:15
Mike O'Neill
At Bench Builders, we focus on transforming good leaders into great ones with practical strategies that drive real results. So I challenge you, lead with purpose and inspire belief and division. Visit bench-builders.com to learn how we can support your leadership journey. John, thank you so much for your valuable insight today. If folks want to reach out to you to connect and learn more, what's the best way for them to do that?

 

00:31:19:17 - 00:31:41:10
John Ghiorso
Yeah. Thanks, Mike. Best way is, is on LinkedIn. Just search my name. I'm sure we'll link to it in the show notes. That's kind of where I hang out most of the time. The first company is called influencer Social. In the, in the portfolio. Second company is yet to be named, it will be an outbound messaging service that should launch in Q1.

 

00:31:41:12 - 00:31:50:05
John Ghiorso
And then, you know, we'll I'll obviously be, be talking about them, on the internet as we, as we launch number three through five.

 

00:31:50:10 - 00:31:57:05
Mike O'Neill
So I'm looking forward to tracking your continued success. John, thank you for joining us.

 

00:31:57:05 - 00:31:58:19
John Ghiorso
Thanks, Mike. Appreciate it.

 

00:31:58:21 - 00:32:12:02
Mike O'Neill
I also want to give a big thank out to the subscribers to this podcast, and I hope that today's discussion provide a useful insights to help you get unstuck and on target.

 

00:32:12:23 - 00:32:16:23
Mike O'Neill
Thank you for joining us for this episode of Get Unstuck and on Target.

 

00:32:17:00 - 00:32:37:13
Mike O'Neill
I hope you gain insights to help you lead with competence and drive your organization forward. Remember it, Bench builders. We're committed to your success, your leadership excellence, and your strategic growth. If you've enjoyed our conversation today, please leave a review rate and subscribe to keep up with our latest episode.

 

00:32:37:22 - 00:32:41:22
Mike O'Neill
This show really grows when listeners like you share it with others.

 

00:32:41:21 - 00:32:45:09
Mike O'Neill
Who do you know? Who needs to hear what we talked about today?

 

00:32:45:18 - 00:32:52:23
Mike O'Neill
Until next time, I encourage you to stay. Focus on the target and continue to break new ground on your leadership path.

John Ghiorso Profile Photo

John Ghiorso

Founder, Co-founder, Entrepreneur

I founded Orca Pacific, a full-service Amazon agency. Over the following decade, I built it into one of the world’s leading Amazon and ecommerce agencies.

In 2020, I made the decision to sell Orca to Media.Monks (S4 Capital). I stayed on for three years to complete my earn-out and further expand the business into the enterprise market. In 2023, I decided to retire but quickly got bored.

I’m now in the process of building my new company, a venture studio that aims to launch five marketing agencies over the next two years. While the studio is yet to be named, it has one agency up and running, with a second close behind.

Unlike the last time around, I’ll be building in public, sharing what I learned from my last company and how I’m applying those lessons to the next five.