Ep191 Marlene Kreidler - Your Job Might Be Replaced by AI, but Your Value Doesn't Have to Be

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Mike O'Neill
AI doesn't have to be.

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Mike O'Neill
Just ask it a question. It gives you an answer. We can embrace it as something. They can just open our horizon in so many different ways.

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Mike O'Neill
welcome to Get Unstuck and On Target, the weekly podcast that offers senior leaders insights and strategies to not only lead with competence and vision,

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Mike O'Neill
but also to achieve groundbreaking results.

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Mike O'Neill
I'm your host, Mick O'Neill. I coach top level executives on the power of ethical leadership to forge teams to be as united as they are effective

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Mike O'Neill
in each episode.

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Mike O'Neill
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Mike O'Neill
Let's get started.

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Mike O'Neill
Welcome to Get Unstuck and On Target. I'm Mike O'Neill, an executive coach. Focus on helping C-suite leaders excel with vision, integrity and excellence. Today, we're exploring a critical topic AI and the next generation workforce. Joining me is Marlene Crider, a seasoned business executive turned professor. In this insightful episode, we'll discuss how the AI generation is reshaping workforce expectations, the ethical considerations in an AI driven world, and strategies to embrace AI while preserving human leadership.

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Mike O'Neill
As you listen, ask yourself, is your leadership ready for the AI revolution? Join us as we unlock insights to help you thrive in this new era of AI powered business.

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Mike O'Neill
Joining me is Marlene Crider. Marlene is a seasoned business executive with over two decades of experience in corporate development, human resources, and leadership development. Marlene has lent her expertise to diverse sectors including health care, higher education, and manufacturing. She's a published author and international speaker, and she currently serves as a professor at the School Distance for Southern Adventist University.

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Mike O'Neill
Today we're diving into I and the next Gen workforce. Marlene will be our compass as we explore this uncharted territory with her visionary approach to business and her genuine care for people. She's going to help us unpack the ethical challenges and opportunities that AI brings to tomorrow's workplace. Welcome, Marlene.

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Marlene Kreidler
Thank you so much, Mike. It's really a pleasure being here. Thank you so much for the introduction. And yeah, I'm really looking forward to for the next 30 minutes. When you and I explore these very interesting topics.

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Mike O'Neill
You know, we can't do anything without seeing the expression AI. And what kind of caught my attention is that we have as listeners, as viewers of this podcast. These are leaders. These are leaders who are hiring employees. And these employees, represent multiple generations. But when we were talking about what could you talk about when you mentioned this, I kind of lit up because what I'm realizing, and I would like you to elaborate on it, is that AI is something new to me, perhaps to you it's still a bit of a novelty, but for those entering the workforce, they've been dealing with AI for a while, more in a academic setting, and this transition to

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Mike O'Neill
the work setting, it raises so many questions. So give us a sense of what is it about the incoming generation and the ethics that go along with AI?

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Marlene Kreidler
Yes, Mike, this has been all of this, and I would say probably within the last 30 days, that has really sparked my attention. You and I have been to so many workshops, seminars, have read a lot of literature about seven different, five different generations, several different generations currently in the workforce. And then I started meditating. What is the next generation?

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Marlene Kreidler
And I started, digging deeper and I found that there is a new generation of people that has been born already. People that were born after 2010, some other scholars say after 2013. And it's the alpha generation, and then

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Marlene Kreidler
how AI East revolutionizing our work. So I tried to put that together and I said, well, the no generation, it shouldn't be called the Alpha generation.

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Marlene Kreidler
It should be called the AI generation. Just one thing. I need to be honest here and be very humble. I say research more. Other people have already pointed that. Yeah, a generation ago. Let's not. So then I wonder why is it called the Alpha generation? Well, the generation of college people right now that are going to be graduating is the Z the last letter of the alphabet.

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Marlene Kreidler
So these researchers were coming up. What is the generation AI is going to be? Oh, the first generation born in the 21st century. Let's go without outside the. That's how they called the alpha. But then as they were doing their research, they also thought, you know, this is the generation fully born when they reached the workforce, AI is going to be fully embedded.

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Marlene Kreidler
So I mean that's a lot of theory. But then I started to think how is it going to affect them and how do we need to prepare them for what's ahead. So that's what sparked my interest.

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Mike O'Neill
You know the timing is something that I didn't make real clear when I introduced you to. And that is you have spent your career in the corporate world and has recently entered academia. And so what you bring to the role in academia, real practical, thinking on that. So walk us through what have you kind of learned thus far?

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Mike O'Neill
What are the things that our listeners as leaders need to kind of be aware of with this incoming generation?

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Marlene Kreidler
I'm going to approach it from two different dimensions. First, the workforce, because that's where pretty much universally the in the workforce, something that organizations need is constantly data analytics. And we hear all the time at universities advertising for MBA or master's degrees in analytics, where companies have now millions of data that they don't know what to do with it, and they need to know not only how to mine it, but also how to make sense of it.

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Marlene Kreidler
So in the workforce, that was a great need. We had. Then I come to academia where we need to plan for 510 years in advance. What are the needs that are going to be there so that the current students we prepare them for four years from their graduate? So then I realized, okay, if they were born the Alpha generation, if they were born in 2010, by the time they enter college, age is going to be about 20, 36 years from now.

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Marlene Kreidler
AI is like it was computers or the internet many, many years ago. So what are we doing first as universities to prepare these future professionals? And second, what worries me the most is the ethical and moral and moral dilemmas. Okay, so because technology, computers, artificial intelligence is going to be doing so much. What are the skills that we need to develop in those 200 right now that are going to grow and be professional.

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Marlene Kreidler
So going to be the leaders of organizations. So what is it that we need to instill in them now that we're on time?

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Mike O'Neill
Are you raised some questions here? I want to try to keep it more practical, because I kind of want go down more of this academic for a bit, but let me stay kind of practical. And that is you've pointed out that the folks who will be entering our workforces. AI is commonplace. What you're point out, though, is those who are in the education system right now, I will be nothing new.

00:09:13:15 - 00:09:37:03
Mike O'Neill
It's going to dramatically change. And you made this reference to data and data analytics. And that is we now have the capacity to analyze data in a way that we never could in the past. The folks who are coming into workforce probably are very savvy on that type of thing. But you mentioned this ethics and the moral dilemmas.

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Mike O'Neill
Tell us a little more about from a from a workplace standpoint, what are these ethical and moral dilemmas?

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Marlene Kreidler
Okay. So try to make it very real with my students, you know, because there is always oh, you cannot use AI. You know, your work needs to be authentic. I say to them use it. But when I ask you a question, you need to be able to have critical thinking skills, critical reasoning, and above all know if this is morally right.

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Marlene Kreidler
I'll give you an example.

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Mike O'Neill
Okay.

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Marlene Kreidler
Computers is garbage in garbage dump. We know that. So if a computer and therefore and a AI,

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Marlene Kreidler
system has been programed, do not hire these type of people. Do not hire people that are younger than BS or older than that. Do not hire these, that and the other. The machine is not going to know is always going to give you the high years that you programed me to produce.

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Marlene Kreidler
Okay, so, our professionals, especially working, they need, in the workforce, they need to be able to say. But this is not right. Okay. And why is it not right? And diversity has hundreds of dimensions. Okay. And why is it not right? So then it's looking to be the way it was programed, the algorithms, all of that.

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Marlene Kreidler
So I say to them you can you say. Be sure to use your critical thinking skills and to be able to make ethical and moral decisions. Is this the right way to treat people? Okay. Even if it's said by something black, when you know, you needed to be something white because it was more cost effective or whatever, because it's what's best for the company.

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Marlene Kreidler
Don't just trust with the machine set. And the other day, you and I were at a mastermind group. Yes. By. And one of the participants made me laugh because he gave me an example of. I. I hadn't thought of that, but I thought it was a great example. He said, Marlene, when you go to a bar and right there, there is a drunk because he's drunk, he's talking and saying everything he wants to say and he doesn't stop talking.

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Marlene Kreidler
And some things are right and things are wrong. But when you base your decisions and everything that the drunkard says, that's what you're doing with a computer with AI.

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Marlene Kreidler
You know, and, the evidence shows that only 40% of the information that a AI produces is correct. So that's what we need to teach our children. Learn how to think, learn to learn how to be intuitive. You learn how to do the things right because that's the right thing to do. So that that's my concern.

00:13:00:11 - 00:13:28:10
Mike O'Neill
Let me see if I'm understanding what you're raising things for us to be thinking about. And that is. But those who are preparing students for the future workforce, they need to be looking years in advance to prepare them. I heard that pretty loud and clear. Yeah. What I also heard is the nature of AI and machine learning is that there is no real, quote, moral compass.

00:13:28:12 - 00:13:54:08
Mike O'Neill
You put information in, it just assumes it builds on that. And if you go to that and ask that platform, whatever it might be, questions, what you're getting back is that which it's captured someplace else. It may or may not be ethically grounded. It may or may not have any. It won't have really any morality, if you would.

00:13:54:10 - 00:14:08:12
Mike O'Neill
But what I think I'm here to say is that in a college setting, you as a professor is you're saying it's okay for you, the student, to use AI, but realize that you don't want to sacrifice critical thinking.

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Marlene Kreidler
That is correct.

00:14:09:13 - 00:14:37:19
Mike O'Neill
And that you need to be able to be mindful that this what you're getting out may not have the qualities we're talking about. Let's talk about the workplace. You spent a long time in senior HR roles and other roles, but those folks coming into the workforce now, they know A.I. but what should we as employers be mindful of, not just for that generation, but for all of our employees?

00:14:37:21 - 00:14:49:07
Mike O'Neill
What might be some of the guardrails that we need to put up as leaders when it comes to the ethical challenges of AI? Does that question make sense?

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Marlene Kreidler
It does make sense. And I think, again, I like to see things in multiple levels, in several dimensions that the existing workforce, they need to be trained to learn to use, the tools available right now. I and, the same thing for the upcoming generation in the workplace, the Z generation. Employers in their resumes are looking for people that know how to use AI, especially for data analytics.

00:15:26:04 - 00:15:57:04
Marlene Kreidler
What we haven't concentrated for many generations is, Mike is just the right thing to do. Okay, generally we go, I scratch your back, you scratch my back. Even though if I know that by scratching your back is not the right thing to do. So it's teaching both technology. And ethical thinking skills. What I would say at all levels, not just the upcoming generation or.

00:15:57:07 - 00:16:14:10
Marlene Kreidler
Yeah, I, I we're also generation. One of my great discoveries was that the NE Casey Foundation that concentrates on helping disadvantaged children and youth.

00:16:15:00 - 00:16:48:20
Marlene Kreidler
They already got it. And I read a lot of information from it because they are already working with children and, but one company is not sufficient you know. And it, it has to spread like weeds. The same way AI is spreading. We need to spread also. And it's not just critical thinking, ethical thinking, world thinking. It's being that, look, all your talents, okay?

00:16:48:21 - 00:17:13:16
Marlene Kreidler
Because right now you see children and everybody engaged in their devices explore outside, you know, be creating a explore the arts, the languages that so many other things so that you are not just laser focus on stamping that might make you a little bit narrow minded.

00:17:13:16 - 00:17:43:09
Mike O'Neill
what I understood you to say in part is employers are hungry to find people who understand these platforms. But the the real art is how do you prompt to get the answers you're looking for? What questions do you ask to get the answers that you get back? What I hear you say is that what we need to be mindful of as leaders is AI doesn't have to be.

00:17:43:09 - 00:17:54:15
Mike O'Neill
Just ask it a question. It gives you an answer. We can embrace it as something. They can just open our horizon in so many different ways. That's the.

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Marlene Kreidler
Right.

00:17:56:02 - 00:18:29:11
Mike O'Neill
The for those leading companies right now, they're in positions of leadership. They have played with ChatGPT. They probably have used it effectively. But the pace of change of this platform seems to be accelerating. The capacity is accelerating. I have had a few other guests speak to this, but from your standpoint, let's go back to your days when you are leading HR.

00:18:29:13 - 00:18:43:02
Mike O'Neill
What are you challenging the leaders in the organization to be doing when it comes to AI? How practically are they supposed to be embracing and not let this be intimidating?

00:18:43:04 - 00:19:14:04
Marlene Kreidler
I think it's by learning. By learning, the capacity and and again, the easiest, analogy is when computers were introduced and Microsoft Office and training employees how to use basic Microsoft Office skills and then the internet. I remember reading Christmas in the past knows how to navigate the internet. People always put their in their resumes. That was an important skill.

00:19:14:06 - 00:19:45:07
Marlene Kreidler
So, we didn't grow up with it. So we need to see how is this new technology going to help me in my industry. It could be in healthcare. It could be in manufacturing service services. Right? Yeah. Huge. Because 70% of the GDP in the U.S. comes from service organizations. So is AI going to replace the majority of those, jobs?

00:19:45:09 - 00:20:17:10
Marlene Kreidler
It's something to think about. So what is a workforce going to do? That's when we as employers, we need to be creative and say, okay, I can't have a computer answering these or responding to these like an Alexa voice or whatever, but I'm still going to need, another human being to do these other, tasks that are extremely important.

00:20:17:10 - 00:20:38:23
Marlene Kreidler
So it's going to be a shift in our thinking and in our doing also. So how can we become more efficient, more effective, more productive, more profitable at the same can be very mindful of the individual needs of the people that might be displaced, but could be retrained.

00:20:39:00 - 00:21:14:08
Mike O'Neill
You know, I've had it described to me that AI is going to eliminate certain roles that are necessary out there, but it doesn't necessarily mean it's going to displace people. If we're willing to use people in new ways. And I think you're challenging us to be mindful of is that those new ways might require training and new skills, exposing them to things they might not otherwise, such that those things that I can do and do well, that's probably exactly what's going to happen.

00:21:14:14 - 00:21:35:24
Mike O'Neill
But what we need to do is be mindful that our employees are not just organic. I they are living, breathing, thinking, loving people. And if we're going to embrace what they can bring in the organization, we're going to have to think creatively. Did I hear that.

00:21:36:01 - 00:22:14:16
Marlene Kreidler
Close to zero? That is correct. And you said it so beautifully. Michael denies a human being is has so many, again, the world comes the need dimensions. Machines don't have emotions. People have. And we need to be very mindful to cater to those emotions. During the pandemic, we went into, remote working, telecommuting and tele socializing, etc. and we see now all the state effects that it had because people did not have a social and emotional context.

00:22:14:18 - 00:22:40:08
Marlene Kreidler
We need to be very mindful of that part of our employees, the emotional, context. So if a robot in a manufacturing company took over your job, well, we're going to need somebody that knows how to program the robot and how to do maintenance to the robot. So I'm going to retrain you, to, to do those, those tasks.

00:22:40:10 - 00:23:02:06
Marlene Kreidler
So now you are not going to be working with your hands. You're going to be working with with your mind. Yeah. And me as an employer, I'm going to take care of your family needs, your personal needs. That affects your family. So it has. Yeah. It has a lot of it's a domino effect.

00:23:02:06 - 00:23:22:14
Mike O'Neill
We have to be looking forward as to what these implications might be. That's your challenge to us as viewers and listeners. Be mindful of those who are entering the workforce. But be looking forward to what those implications might be. And you've kind of wanted out some things that we need to be mindful of.

00:23:22:16 - 00:23:36:21
Mike O'Neill
Let me invite you to look back, just for a moment. Can you think of an example where perhaps you were a client got stuck and what that happened, what it did take to get unstuck?

00:23:37:08 - 00:24:08:15
Marlene Kreidler
I mean, there have been so many situations when I felt stuck and but the most recent one is when I started, John, when teaching at the university here, I had, luckily two months to prepare for my classes, and I'm a planner. I planned everything, so when no faculty orientation came, I went so proudly with all my work plans.

00:24:08:15 - 00:24:34:01
Marlene Kreidler
I showed it to the dean and I, you know, so, so proud of what I had accomplished. And she said Monday, don't be surprised if you have to change it. So I could do that with faculty training. And they showed us a chart that we needed to create. In other words, all the planning that I had done for the whole semester.

00:24:34:03 - 00:25:08:13
Marlene Kreidler
You needed to be done in pictures. I don't like a diagram. And it has a name that I forget the name, what it is the type of diagram I call. Well, where do I go from here? Okay. And so I was right there, and I wasn't the only one. The other professors were the same. And then I heard somebody say, I just made the ChatGPT and I described a piece.

00:25:08:15 - 00:25:42:18
Marlene Kreidler
Why did you do. I typed these, that and the other, and it was. Tell me how to do these, that and the other. But you have to be specific. And it was incredibly well, which I typically came with. And then I kept digging and digging that dig in and then somebody else, you can even do pictures. Okay, so, show me a picture of getting unstuck in a work problem.

00:25:42:20 - 00:26:21:16
Marlene Kreidler
And the one picture. Now, I don't like this picture. So I didn't used it, but it unstuck me. Okay. It it it opened my mind initially I did copy some references basically to pass because we needed to be done by Friday a day. Yeah. So but then but then I go to my office and I start refining it based on my thinking.

00:26:22:20 - 00:26:29:22
Marlene Kreidler
Ready? Yeah. Help me get it. Get unstuck. But the follow up is you have to analyze it.

00:26:30:17 - 00:27:05:20
Marlene Kreidler
Okay. You have to analyze it because great ideas. But at the end I realized they didn't really match what I had been thinking. So but, but yeah that that was an moment. And I keep learning I keep learning. So it's when I get stuck it's a little bit difficult because I think so much. So I have to read a lot and start writing.

00:27:05:22 - 00:27:13:01
Marlene Kreidler
And then the moment comes after I start writing and reviewing, writing and review and.

00:27:13:03 - 00:27:40:00
Mike O'Neill
I don't know if I've told you this, Marlene, but, you know, I always knew you in your professional role in my interactions with you. When you said that I've accepted a teaching position at the university, it struck me as that's a perfect use of kind of who you are, how you think. You think at a deep level. That kind of came through pretty loud and clear in this conversation.

00:27:40:02 - 00:28:08:22
Mike O'Neill
And that is you are challenging us to don't just react, be thinking about what's going on. Be mindful of those folks who are entering our work force, those who are here. And how do we embrace this fast changing technology? How do we use it in a way that takes into consideration that AI doesn't have feelings?

00:28:10:14 - 00:28:42:08
Mike O'Neill
It's not designed for that. But then you gave us an example by which you were so quote prepared with your lesson plans. It was clear to you. But when you were told no that's not acceptable, you need to present it in this total different way that use an AI to kind of help bridge how do I take what I do understand and put it in a new format that speaks to the needs of the university?

00:28:42:10 - 00:29:00:18
Mike O'Neill
But as you learned that you found how powerful it can actually be. You know, as I kind of reflect on our conversation, we've covered a number of things. What do you want our viewers and listeners to have as their takeaways? Marlene.

00:29:00:20 - 00:29:39:12
Marlene Kreidler
I think, that in the midst of technology advances takes me back to my days in college, and I cannot remember right now the name of the book that we read. The higher the technology, the more touch we need. So always be mindful of the people around you and their human needs. Be authentic in the sense that you want to be treated.

00:29:39:14 - 00:30:02:06
Marlene Kreidler
You want to treat people the same way you want to be treated. And the golden rule making decisions, not because that's what the university needs from me in today's, but because this is the right thing to do. Okay. Yeah. Right now you have a crisis, but then you you go, you meditate, you fix your mistakes. So that's where authenticity comes.

00:30:02:06 - 00:30:38:21
Marlene Kreidler
Or integrity and and Jerry's. Start thinking how does my decision affects the people around me? I think that's the most the most important thing. And the children around being the young people around me, how do I want to, encourage them to also be ethical and moral leaders? How do they incorporate that into daily lives? And it's not easy.

00:30:39:01 - 00:31:11:09
Marlene Kreidler
You know, the act of being transparent makes herself very vulnerable. But it's okay to be vulnerable. I, this last week, my students, had a test. An exam, and prior to the exam, I gave them the QR code to rate me. So I know how how well they rate it. 167 1995 different ways. So the next class after the exam, I showed them how they rated me.

00:31:12:02 - 00:31:37:05
Marlene Kreidler
And I had a colleague is smiling. You're crazy. You know, you're making yourself very vulnerable. And I said, if they don't read me, how do I know that I'm meeting their needs and expectations? And I ask them, so the act of transparency, of authenticity makes you very vulnerable. But at the same time, that's the only way you can grow and you can help other people grow.

00:31:37:08 - 00:31:46:16
Marlene Kreidler
So in other words, it's not just teaching and preaching. It's also being good role models for the generations that are coming.

00:31:46:18 - 00:32:15:08
Mike O'Neill
That's very well said. You know, before we wrap up, I do have a question for the leaders in the audience, and that is why do people choose to follow your lead? Is it out of obligation or do they truly believe in your vision? Leadership thrives on clarity and confidence. It's not just about holding authority, it's about creating practical solutions that drive real bottom line results.

00:32:15:10 - 00:32:45:06
Mike O'Neill
As an executive coach, I help leaders achieve bottom line impact. They become inspiring people that they want to follow. So at Bench Builders, which is my business, we provide personal strategies used in fortune 500 insights to drive significant progress towards your goals. So I invite you to lead in a way that draws people to your vision, not because they have to, but because they are inspired to.

00:32:45:08 - 00:33:00:07
Mike O'Neill
If you want to learn more, let me invite you. Visit Bench builders.com and let's see how we can support your leadership journey. You know, Marlene, your insights have been so valuable. Thank you for joining us.

00:33:00:09 - 00:33:09:19
Marlene Kreidler
And Mike, thank you so much for this wonderful, wonderful opportunity. I really enjoyed it. And I would like to continue the conversations when maybe we have the chance.

00:33:09:21 - 00:33:19:05
Mike O'Neill
Well, I'm looking forward to doing just that now for folks who have heard you and said, gosh, I want to engage further, what's the best way for them to reach out to you?

00:33:19:07 - 00:33:50:22
Marlene Kreidler
They can either connect through Linked In. My. If you can share my full name, my email is Marlene and a r e n e Kreidler k r e I e r ag Montcalm. I would welcome your comments either via LinkedIn. We're going to posting these, podcast also there. I would really like to hear your feedback and thank you so much for this opportunity.

00:33:50:24 - 00:34:13:17
Mike O'Neill
Well, it's been my pleasure. I think it's been our listeners pleasure. We will in fact post that information in the show notes. So Marlene, thank you. And I also want to kind of say a big thank you to the subscribers for tuning in. And I hope today's discussion provided you with some insights that will help you get unstuck and on target.

00:34:14:11 - 00:34:18:11
Mike O'Neill
Thank you for joining us for this episode of Get Unstuck and on Target.

00:34:18:13 - 00:34:39:01
Mike O'Neill
I hope you gain insights to help you lead with competence and drive your organization forward. Remember it, Bench builders. We're committed to your success, your leadership excellence, and your strategic growth. If you've enjoyed our conversation today, please leave a review rate and subscribe to keep up with our latest episode.

00:34:39:10 - 00:34:43:10
Mike O'Neill
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00:34:43:09 - 00:34:46:22
Mike O'Neill
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00:34:47:06 - 00:34:54:11
Mike O'Neill
Until next time, I encourage you to stay. Focus on the target and continue to break new ground on your leadership path.